How ministry placements are decided has always been a hot topic. During gauntlet week, the interns take a battery of skills and personality tests. At the end of the week, they are given their job assignments which range from cafeteria workers and janitors all the way up to Ron’s executive assistants. TM leadership constantly tells interns that their particular job was specifically given to them by God. It is their personal calling for the year. Thus, any complaints or dissatisfaction are seen as complaining against God himself and His perfect will. (FYI – this is a great manipulation tool if you ever want to start your own cult.)
Now, there is much that can be said about the entire free labor system at TM. There are definite pros and cons to it. In my opinion, the biggest downside is the potential for exploitation which many alumni have reported over the years (ridiculous workloads, crushing overtime, too much responsibility without training, too much stress, etc.) The idea of volunteering for a year seems good on paper, but there are many times the kids providing the free labor have been abused, then spat out the other side when they are burned out.
One alumnus recently sent me this note, which adds another angle to the conversation:
“I just finished talking with a couple Army Recruiters I work with. I was asking them about their process for putting new recruits into their job assignments. Here’s what they said:
Q – How does the Army determine what job assignment the new recruit will receive, and are the new recruits aware of what job they will be doing prior to enlisting?
A – Potential recruits take the ASVAB (Armed Services Vocational Aptitude Battery) and receive their scores prior to enlisting. Based on the scores they earn on their test, they are told which jobs they qualify for. Since the test covers a multitude of subjects, they narrow it down to 5 or 6 of the 212 Army positions available. Then, knowing what jobs they may get, they can choose to enlist or decline.
It is my belief that TM waits until the interns arrive before assigning them a job assignment so they can use guilt and manipulation to pressure the interns into a job that they may not be satisfied with. Not even the secular military does this. Shame on TM.”
I think the whole free labor (well, free isn’t the right word since you are paying to work for TM!) is a complex thing. On the one hand, in some cases, it does give people good job experience that can benefit them later in life. And that is part of the selling point in TM literature. But what about the majority of people who work in manual labor or the call center? I’d hardly call that valuable job experience, especially when you consider those are entry level jobs you could get elsewhere and actually get paid for it.
I remember actually enjoying my ministry placement most of the time, even with the tons of overtime. It was kind of a badge of honor; we all wanted to have good war stories. In fact, I’ll bet that most of you have swapped war stories with other interns, trying to see who lived through the most ridiculous circumstances and with the least amount of sleep. Once, when I complained about the overtime hours, my manager threatened to send me to another department as punishment (the idea clearly being that going to another dept. meant I couldn’t “hack it”). It wasn’t until I was an adult that it dawned on me that I, and many in my class, had been exploited.
Then, of course, we have the social hierarchy that comes with the ministry placements as well as many other conflicts of interest and sketchy situations.
So what do you make of the fact that TM runs almost entirely off its free labor force?
23 comments:
Anonymoussays:July 21, 2010 at 8:16 AM
I worked in a very small and humble ministry and I was paid by them. . . .
Justj33says:July 21, 2010 at 8:39 AM
I rather enjoyed my ministry placement. I was the “recording engineer and duplication manager”
anyways I was never told that “God” put where I was. actually my manager saw me during gauntlet week and thought I looked like someone who would be good at my job. that’s what she told me when I asked her how did I get my placement.
anyways,
I never took any test or at least I don’t remember taking any. I always thought the staff members and GIs just picked who they wanted in their dep kinda like a draft pick. that’s was I was lead to believe anyways. maybe Im wrong about that.
laynesays:July 21, 2010 at 9:23 AM
Justj33 – Did they have the Myers-Briggs or the Four Tempraments test while you were there? Did you go through the ropes course?
Nunquam Honorablussays:July 21, 2010 at 9:35 AM
JustJ33- when were you an intern??
In 2008 (heck, 2009), they were still doing the testing and the “this is where God has put you” mumbo jumbo.
CarrieSaumsays:July 21, 2010 at 9:48 AM
I had a very difficult time in my job. And I distinctly remember being scoped out during Gauntlet week, multiple times by multiple managers. During my first (and only) meeting with my IA, I expressed a little bit of concern about my job placement. She acted baffled that I would even bring it up, because, for whatever reason, that is where God wanted me and I needed to “make it work”.
For years after my TM job, I had managers who either thought I was amazing because I was such a diligent and devoted worker (i.e. workaholic), or would lament that someone, very early on, got their claws into me and royally f***ed me up. It has taken me many years to unravel what happened at TM in regards to my job, and to disentangle my sense of self worth from my work.
Also, I think that interns are required to do SO MUCH MORE than what is ever expressed before they arrive. I knew we would have certain requirements we would have to meet, like QT’s and exercise. But then my manager had me do several John Maxwell book-on-tape/CD studies, and then quiz me on what I had learned. If I missed a day listening to the books, then she would confront me on not managing my time well. Oh, and I worked a minimum of 10 hrs/day. And if we had Character Development or some other class that cut C shift short, I had to go back to work after dinner and finish everything on my extensive to-do list (which did NOT include the book listening) before I could leave for the day. And then it all started over again the next day at 7:30 a.m.
I think TM definitely exploits free labor from people who are sometimes still children (17 and under), and not quite adults (18-20).
Josh ex-intern 00-01says:July 21, 2010 at 9:50 AM
Justj33 said… “anyways,
I never took any test or at least I don’t remember taking any. I always thought the staff members and GIs just picked who they wanted in their dep kinda like a draft pick. that’s was I was lead to believe anyways. maybe Im wrong about that.”
Those “tests” were the ones you took during Gaunlet week. The Myers-Briggs test, and others. Plus, all the interviews they do. For me it was different. I knew where I was going because I knew the previous security supervisor, and she requested that I be assigned there.
I think it’s pretty disgusting. And horrendously manipulative. It’d be one thing if the interns weren’t guilted into overworking, FORCED into overworking… but I’d be interested in knowing how helpful the experience acquired at HA is for the typical intern. I understand that it’s probably somewhat helpful, but…
Kristasays:July 21, 2010 at 11:04 AM
I’ve come to realize that taking personality tests and basing the results on where you should be placed ministry-wise is really a crazy practice. Sure, you’re going to have a few people who get the right “fit” but anyone who studies personality testing will tell you that the results can be incredibly skewed during a time of transition in someones life…i.e. leaving home for the first time,starting a new “job”, moving away from everything familiar, etc… For example: I remember answering questions on the Meyers Briggs test based on the kind of person I wanted to be, not who I actually was (though I don’t know how anyone could expect a 17-18 year old to really know who they really are at that point). Anyway, I got a job placement as a recruiter/mobilizer which was fine, except I’ve now come to realize that I’m more introverted than what my results showed on my tests. As a result, I was always exhausted from trying to be this incredibly extroverted people person. This led to me feeling like I didn’t measure up because I never felt like I could achieve it because that’s not naturally who I am!
Renaesays:July 21, 2010 at 11:17 AM
I ended up in the call center, even though I’ve always been uncomfortable taking to people I don’t know. I discovered my phobia of calling people I don’t know the first day, when I had a nervous breakdown/panic attack. I’m so grateful to my MA, assistant MA, and call team for being extremely merciful and grace-filled towards me and allowing me to take it slow, but I ended up having one more breakdown during the year. I should have been moved, but that was never presented as an option to me. Instead, I had to accept God’s will, He would never give me more than I could handle, He’ll put me in the toughest places to teach me a lesson, etc. etc. Man, the God I knew back then was such a bully.
Anonymoussays:July 21, 2010 at 11:17 AM
My manager told me that I was in my ministry placement because God “ordained” that I be there. I laughed and said “Nope, I’m in this department because I am good with Excel.” Because that’s when they stopped really listening to me during the interview process. “Oh… you’re good with spreadsheets…”
If only I’d mentioned being proficient with Photoshop before Excel… maybe I would have avoided the Intern Relations department altogether.
Justj33says:July 21, 2010 at 11:35 AM
well…I was an Aug. intern in 04-05. now that you mention it I do believe I took the Myers-Briggs test, maybe some others but like I said I can’t quite remember which ones.
and yes I do remember the ropes courses.
Like I said My supervisor at the time ,Betsy, who was the head of the rec. department said she saw me during that time and figured that I Looked like some one who could work in the auditorium. which in the case she right, previously I had been apart of the audio dep. at my old church for many years.
that’s why I felt like maybe interns were chosen by staff for particular placement.
so it is safe to say that they use the test for the most part and staff can choose who that want as well?
CarrieSaumsays:July 21, 2010 at 11:53 AM
One other thing I would like to note about the personality tests: Our personalities are not who we are. They are a coping mechanism to help us survive this world, and I don’t think that the tests should be taken too seriously. I remember taking my spiritual gifting test, and scored a 12 on compassion when i first took it at the beginning of the year. i took it again at the end of the year, and i was 93 on compassion. people change, personalities change, even giftings change as we mature. to base an entire year around a handful of subjective personality testing is ridiculous, especially for teenagers. 🙂
Justj – What you didn’t know is that during the ropes course they were analyzing you the whole time, taking notes on the “traits” you displayed, etc.
justj33 – sorry for the delay, I forgot to hit publish!
Justj33says:July 21, 2010 at 1:06 PM
no, prob!
This t-shirt is relevant to this topic.
http://www.peopleofwalmart.com/?p=15414
laynesays:July 21, 2010 at 2:00 PM
justj33 – “So it is safe to say that they use the test for the most part and staff can choose who that want as well?”
Like you said earlier, it’s very closely related to a draft. Some of the departments have the ability to choose a certain number of interns first, particularly the specialty departments such as Exec and IT. Most of the “higher ups” are able to choose their AA’s pretty immediately. Once the specialty departments (and by “specialty” I mean departments that need people with a special skill set, like programmers…could you imagine TM trying to teach an intern how to program and then expect them to start writing code in less than a month? hah!) other departments get their pick, and I’m sure there’s a whole ranking system for that as well. At the end, those who are left are usually placed the call center. Cause, yeah, God ordained it.
Carolsays:July 21, 2010 at 2:52 PM
Ministry placement was particularly hard for me, looking back. Right before the internship I had been the Executive Assistant to a VP at a nation wide non-profit organization. He was so impressed with my skills (at 18) that he offered me a career in the organization. Of course I turned it down to go to TM and be placed in the call center. Later, there was a nation-wide search to fill the position I was in, and a person from the mid-west flew out to interview for the position. If only I knew then what I know now. *sigh*
I was placed in the call center, of course, where the majority of folks were placed during my time at TM. Did TM utilize my skills – ABSOLUTELY NOT! If they had, I’m sure I would have been placed as someone’s executive assistant considering my experience. However, back in 1997 we did not submit resumes, etc… to TM for ministry placement. Too bad for them though, even though I am a professor now and love my job more than I could ever describe, details, and serving others,are still my strong point. But, I accepted my assignment and stuck with it throughout my time at TM, faithfully.
This.
And that.
And the other thing.
And… oh, just go read the whole site.
JacklovesJillsays:July 21, 2010 at 6:21 PM
Oh the stories I could tell on the GE side of things concerning placement of countries for Team Leaders and how they were ALWAYS told “this is where God wants you” when the truth was “This is where a PD wanted you or more often then not where a PD did not want you.” I believed that lie for so many years until I became a PD and saw people I previously looked up to manipulating thee system by saying they would do Dallas as long as GE sent them to New Zealand. Ya God had a lot to do with ministry placement of GE side also. TM uses this all the time….
HKHsays:July 21, 2010 at 9:16 PM
Yea… I was placed in the call center and hated almost every minute of it. I am an extrovert by nature, but sitting in a call center, on the frickin phone all day long, was absolutely NOT my calling. My team captain didn’t want me on the team either because of my lack of drive to be on the phones. I would talk to my aisle neighbors all the time, and was always addressed cause I wasn’t working. My favorite part of that job was the travels to the ATF events and the actual hands-on work to set up at events.
I would have much rather done kitchen or cleaning…anything but the call center, and really, I never felt that God “picked” that job for me necessarily, nor do I remember being told that, but I know He definitely used it for His own glory in my life, as scripture promises. Regardless of how much I hated what I did, I loved the people I was in there with and have been fortunate enough to have lasting relationships with quite a few of them.
Anonymoussays:July 22, 2010 at 8:29 AM
I wish I could say good things about GE and my job placement. It did not help me in my future job hunt in any sense of the word. I do not know why I was picked for my ministry placement. I have ALWAYS hated little games and pseudo Christian team building efforts of the sort that were played during gauntlet. I wish I had my 120 hour work weeks back. We had just enough time to walk back to the dorms and get about 6 hours sleep, as long as you didn’t eat or shower. SO with eating one meal and showering you had about 4.5 to 5 hours of sleep.
I was never a good pick for my MP. I doubt there was a good place for me.
The methods of picking the MP for interns was biased against people like me. Introverted, intelligent, critical thinking people.
2001-BA
Uknowsays:July 26, 2010 at 7:02 PM
I was very close with my manager. I actually moved from the K crew into custodial. My manager and I were talking one day about ministry placements and she told me about the process…. She said it was similar to the draft with each dept getting picks and there was a board of 100 or so “top” picks and each dept would fight over the “top picks”