Since Dave seems to want all the questions emailed in prior to the call, let’s congregate them here so we can make sure that everyone’s questions are addressed. Put your question(s) in the comments. Here are mine:
ESOAL:
1) What exact changes have been made to ESOAL and when?
2) Have medical professionals, not affiliated with TM, determined that ESOAL is reasonable and safe? If so, can you give us the names of the doctor(s) that will endorse ESOAL?
3) Have any psychology professionals not affiliated with Teen Mania endorsed ESOAL? If so, can you give us their names?
Health and Safety:
4) How are the standards and expectations for corporate exercise determined?
5) Have medical professionals determined that the expectations for corporate exercise are reasonable and safe? If so, can you give us the names of the doctor(s) that will endorse your exercise practices?
6) Why do interns who face injury and sickness ROUTINELY report that they are confronted and judged for being lazy and a lesser Christian?
7) Are the routine “interrogations” and “persecutions” administered during various LTEs and other activities (World Awareness, Core Group Meetings, etc) safe and supervised by medically knowledgeable people?
8) Through the overuse and misapplication of “Beat your body and make it your slave,” interns are conditioned to believe that physical injuries and suffering = spiritual maturity. Is this a sound theological and medical proposition?
9) Why are so many interns counseled to pray for healing in lieu of seeking medical attention or taking their medication?
9b) In one story, an injured intern came to you during the he World Awareness LTE. She says that you told her, “Does remaining in a dorm room for a weekend, or remaining in a campsite surrounded by your peers make any difference at this point. If you can walk you can continue the LTE.” She continues, “So for an entire weekend…I was without pain medication, sleep deprived, dirty, and in some of the worst pain of my life. “ Why didn’t you offer her medical care?
10)What kind of access do interns have to medical care? (Especially those without their own vehicle.)
11)Why do you tell interns that “You can sleep when you are dead.” or “Tired people rule the world”?
12)Are there any adults over the age of 25 on long road trips? Are interns required to have 8 hours of sleep before driving on road trips? If so, how is that enforced?
Spiritual Abuse:
13)In your response letter, you said that the Honor Academy is not for everyone. Who, exactly, is the Honor Academy for?
14)Why aren’t interns free to leave at anytime during the year without condemnation from their leadership and their peers?
15)Why do you tell interns that those who quit the internship have the odds stacked against them in their ability to become a successful leader?
16)How do you justify kicking people out of your good graces when Jesus specialized in including sinners, the unclean and those outside the religious mainstream?
17)How do you justify an obsession with leadership, honor and statesmanship over the grace, love and inclusion that Jesus modeled? On what Scriptural basis do you justify that honor is the most important attribute of the Christian life?
18)Why do you promote a culture of confrontation and extreme judgment and then act surprised when interns feel condemned?
19)Describe Orange Block and the reasoning behind it.
Other Questions:
According to your marketing material for CCM, interns who select the acting track will, “receive traditional acting training from professional actors/actresses and drama coaches.” There is not now, nor has there ever been a professional actor or actress heading this program at CCM.
20) Do you plan to hire a professional, do you plan to change your marketing material, or do you plan to continue with false advertising?
21) What financial restitution will you make for those who signed up for the program but did not receive the professional training as promised?
22)How many staff members in the Honor Academy have come to the HA as adults over the age of 30? Or is the majority of the staff comprised of people who spent their formative years at TM?
23) Given the fact that interns whose behavior violates certain moral standards or HA rules are placed on a probationary period, what do you feel is an appropriate probationary period for the sins that you’ve committed? And what would be an appropriate “growth plan?”
We keep hearing “we’re making changes”… I would like to know, what are some of the specific changes they are addressing?
Furthermore, what are the changes that they stated will take place with ESOAL? Since this is an alumni-centric call, I would very much appreciate it if we could bypass the secrecy, since most of us have experienced ESOAL firsthand 😉
Has anyone contacted Fox News or the AP? It seems pretty obvious that some sort of third party needs to be involved here to keep tm accountable.
I’m sure Fox News & the AP have other things to worry about.
The biggest question I would like to have answered was stated by Nunquam, what are the specific changes that have happened but specifically what changes are in the works
I agree with NH. That would be a huge question for me.. SPECIFICALLY, what has changed?
Also, I would be interested to know the financial breakdown of the cost of a GE mission trip. I will expound in the forums at a later time as to why this information would be helpful.
if I can learn how to record using Google Voice, i will do so.
1. Why does the HA seem to believe that a more strict morality is needed than is biblically mandated? The Zealots of Jesus’ day weren’t embraced by the early church, and Jesus clearly rejected the Pharisees rule based spirituality. Doesn’t the “honor code/honor ring/honor academy” base itself on a belief that the actions in the life you lead are more important than the faith you hold? It’s true that we’re challenged in James in that it is impossible to demonstrate faith without deeds, but isn’t it a stretch to then say that good deeds equal good faith?
2. Aura of a Stateman – How is this ideology defensible in any grace based economy of the Gospel? Where is this found in Paul’s writings? While he was certainly an intellectual and religious authority, how does this statesman idea jive with Paul’s crass language, harsh lifestyle, and at times melancholy disposition? It seems like this is simply an application of “Mr. Smith Goes to Washington” played outside of the big screen. It seems like you’re teaching influence by a manipulative lifestyle instead of a testimony of a redeemed life.
3. ESOAL – Scripture clearly teaches that physical discipline does nothing to curtail the brokenness of the heart. So why would the HA cling to a practice rooted in pulling spiritual understanding from physical activity?
4. The HA regularly claims not to be a church. By sidestepping the responsibility of being a church, isn’t the HA forsaking it’s claim of spiritual instruction and authority? I’m not suggesting that Ron and Dave become Pastors, but I’m saying as leaders within a spiritual Christian community, they must be accountable to the same standard. This standard would demand a much more grace focused environment and atmosphere than I’ve seen demonstrated at the HA. Jesus’ leaders were broken and errant…so why does the HA only embrace it’s brightest shining members?
^ win.
#2 specifically- Hasz mentioned in class once that he doesn’t believe that Aura of a Statesman is biblical- it’s “just [his] opinion”.
Then WHY is it taught from the pulpit, with similar rules? That is what I would like to know.
Why is the Honor Academy militarized?
The military itself exists for war and its values are that of aggression and violence. In the ESOAL video 1, we watch participants yell, “it pays to be a winner and you’re a loser”. It is shocking to see them comply with their leader’s demand, but is the result of being taught never to question authority. This is an act of violence. The exercise taught greed and disregard for the sanctity of life. Such is a slippery slope in normalizing aggression toward fellow humans. If part of ESOAL is to be ‘preparation for kidnap on the mission field’ then the logical end we’ll see is the compliance of a participant murdering a fellow captive in order to save one’s own life.
And yet Jesus taught “blessed are the peacemakers”. Please explain the inspiration for conflating Christian service with militarism – this is an order of which I have been unable to find grounded in Scripture.
Phil, on point number four, you could add that just because it is a group of believers it qualifies as a church. I know as calling myself a Christian, I open myself up to the accountability of other believers. It shouldn’t be any different with a ministry made up of believers.
I don’t think I can listen in tonight. My whole body tenses up when I even think about it. The symptoms of PTSD aren’t worth it for me. However, I would be interested in the context of the girl (I forgot her name) who had to sign that confidentiality agreement about the Unreached People Group LTE and why she needed to sign it.
Also, I would like an explanation of how ESOAL differs from hazing. If someone would like to ask those questions on my behalf, I would appreciate it. 🙂
1) Mr. Hasz and the HA program as a whole push repentance and reparations to those whom the interns have hurt in their past. AA and Celebrate Recovery have steps that back this up as well.
I was very wounded by my boss during my internship. I was confronted daily on non-issues, yelled at in public settings, blamed for things that went wrong that were out of my control and well beyond my scope of responsibility. I was also forced to work overtime and then asked lie about it, with the promise that I would have “comp” days to make up for it. Those comp days never came, and I was still asked to lie about how many hours and days I was working. I still have many persistent issues about performing in the workplace and have struggled with being a workaholic as a direct result of interactions with this boss.
My question to you is this: What reparations and restitution is TM willing to put forth in a situation like mine? A direct apology and acknowledgment of wrong-doing will go a very long way, but these are wounds that have required a crazy amount of care. Many others that I know have also experienced similar situations with similar repercussions.
2) When Interns or missionaries sign up for the HA or GE trip and arrive at GV with their money in hand, it goes into an account with their ID number on it. If an intern is unwilling or unable to complete their year (or a missionary, their GE trip) for whatever reason, it is standard practice for TM to keep those funds, regardless of the Intern or missionary’s reason for not completing the program. Under no known circumstances does an intern or missionary receive those funds back, nor are the funds returned to the original donor. TM keeps a prety hard line on why they do NOT return the funds: fear of money laundering or fraud. However, from my personal experience and in-depth research into this matter, I can say with absolute certainty that this is not true. Donated money that is designated for a specific use can be refunded at any time if the perameters or purpose of the gift is not realized. For example: Someone donates $100,000 to a church building fund (and denotes that designated information on the check, or in a letter with the donation) and the building does not get to the construction phase. The church can absolutely refund those donations, even in part, minus the cost of labor/planning, etc. This is not considered illegal, money laundering, or fradulent in anyway as long as the donor is notified that the returned donation is NOT tax deductible.
Why does TM keep the money, and say that it is illegal to return it when clearly it is not?
3) When will you address Recovering Alumni as a body,and not as a person? RA is one voice of many. Can you please regard and address us as such in the future?
I said: I would like to know your answer to the following: For what purpose(s) did Jesus live a sinless life?
Do interns still make a commitment to not speak anything negative about TMM, staff, intern or otherwise? If so what is the logic behind this?
What do you believe is the value of human emotions?
Do you recognize personality disorders?
If so what does TMM do when staff members or interns exhibit characteristics that are particularly volatile towards others?
Do you give potential staff members psychological examinations as a way of avoiding hiring others who may have an insatiable desire to control others?
How has the diet for the intern population improved? Specifically what do they eat?
Why is it that the shuttle to the hospital no longer runs?
What constitutes a strike against a staff members job? Questioning the salvation of an intern? How many strikes are staff members given before fired? Have any staff members been fired because of their inappropriate ways of dealing with interns? If we as alumni have been treated inappropriately by a staff member who is still on staff who do we need to report to?
I’ve notified two different media outlets as well as an independent writer who covers fundamentalist stories.
Download the Conference Call audio recording here: http://recoveringalumniresponse.com/conference-call/