Humiliation and shaming are two of the most popular tools for “growth” at the Honor Academy. In his talk “Aura of a Statesmen” (available on iTunes) Dave Hasz recounts this story.
I’ve never used the word F-A-R-T in front of my wife or my daughter. Ladies, I don’t ever want to hear that word come out of your mouth. Because a lady is not going to say that word.
I was driving a van full of interns. A lady in the back said, “Who farted?” Here’s what I did. I slammed on the brakes and pulled over and said, “Please don’t use that word, there are ladies in the van.” She said, “How can you say that to me? I am a lady!” And I said, “You haven’t proven that to me based on your vocabulary.”
Not only does Dave Hasz engage in this behavior, he brags about it! He sees absolutely nothing wrong with humiliating someone to prove a point.
As I recall, Jesus had the opportunity to shame a woman. The woman at the well already had 5 husbands and was even shacking up at the time that He met her. Did Jesus use this knowledge to shame her? Did he even confront her sin at all? No. He was gracious and loving and extended life to her.
Grace and love is how Jesus wins us. Grace and love is what causes transformation in our lives. Not only does humiliation not even work to change our hearts – its 100% against the very nature and person of Jesus Christ.
17 comments:
i actually remember that from the same talk when i was there… it’s so hard to not just rail against dave or anyone else at the HA over that stuff in the same ways they do it, because honestly it’s enraging sometimes… but more than i’m angry i want so much more for them to see the real gospel. one that dignifies the undignified.. gives a high status to the ‘unladylike’ and worse.
Yeah, I remember him saying that. When I was there I felt so much like I had to be this perfect intern girl you know? I had to dress stylish and look pretty 100% of the time. and the worst part is this is what the guys heard to, so THEY were pressuring us as well! it almost felt like, if I wasn’t totally pretty all the time, and didn’t fit into this mold they had already prepared for me, I wasn’t a righteous girl. I really did believe that for a very long time.
truly.
And I bet the guys had a lot of pressure too to be the “trailer club” man.
Which it’s good to act like a woman and act like a man, but when there is all this pressure that when you don’t you aren’t a woman or you aren’t a man, it’s really crushing spiritually. you feel like you are so not good enough.
i guess i just don’t understand what that has to do with Jesus. i mean, i get that dave’s opinion is that it’s not “classy” for a lady to say that kind of thing…
…but that whole talk makes it seem as though classy = Christian…and it doesn’t, necessarily. in fact, sometimes being his definition of “classy” is actually detrimental to our witness–it can come across as judgmental and arrogant, and compromise the very message we’re attempting to live.
Dave also makes it sound as though Christian women don’t say “Fart” — as though it is a sin for a woman to use the word fart. That would imply that God holds women to a different standard than he does men.
Really, what is the point of Dave’s story?
That is a good point, Z.
This is also a perfect example of how they say one thing and do another. Dave says he wants interns to think for themselves and not just follow his advice/orders blindly. Yet, he humiliates and shames those who don’t go along with his opinions.
Both Dave and the interns that comment here try to act like you have total free choice while you are there – but its patently untrue. Threats of shaming are every bit as real and painful as threats of physical violence.
Wow. I can’t really imagine being told that I’m not a “lady” (whatever that means) because I used a word that’s not even profane. This may be a minor thing in the grand scheme of Teen Mania’s many wrong actions, but it’s symptomatic of so much else, especially sexism.
It’s troubling when someone preaches constantly about the importance of gender and gender roles (which is something I certainly experienced at TM, even if it was mostly under the guise of, “God wants to you be a woman/man of God”) AND THEN totally negates your womanhood because of a silly word.
And you know what? I say a LOT “worse” things than fart in my daily life, and I am still DEFINITELY a woman. Or, should I say, a “lady.”
Meanwhile, off topic: Isn’t simply using the word lady kind of sexist here, anyway? It’s probably used as an opposite to being a man, and so it mirrors the whole girl/man problem that I encounter almost daily, when a man and woman of the same age and status will be referred to differently — the woman will be “girl” but the man will be “man.” This seems similar.
Well the Evangelical church (and other branches of Christianity as well) tends to be full of sexism. It’s fairly easy to back up with scripture. If you’re going to be in a religion that claims to take the Bible as the Literal Word of God, be prepared to deal with some of what most people would consider sexism. Read Paul lately?
There is so much problematic about this incident, even without touching on issues of sexism. There are many layers here we could discuss.
Of course, the fact that Dave cares so much about the word fart is ridiculous and points to how out of touch the HA is. But, to me, the most important thing here is the “righteous” use of shaming.
Shame is something Jesus came to free us from. He NEVER uses shame to punish or change us. Clearly, Dave is showing us by this example that in this way he absolutely unlike Jesus.
The fact that Dave not only shames people, but is proud enough about it to brag on stage should be very alarming to anyone thinking about sending their child to the HA. This kind of shaming is not an isolated incident, but rather the bread and butter of the Honor Academy program.
Where is Jesus in that?????
i was a jan. intern in 2006. married a girl in my sister core (aug. 2005-2006). we took a lot of heat for getting married. i really don’t think the HA lives in the real world or even represents Jesus very well.
Who is Ron to tell someone who they should or shouldn’t marry or when they should marry? Hmmm. . . shot gun wedding. . . nice way to get around the no dating policy!
Married Anonymous…
If you don’t mind my asking, why was there so much affliction with you two simply getting married?
I always thought that it was taboo to NOT marry a fellow alumnus… geez, Status Quo, make up your mind!!
My social psych teacher recently used this quote “There is no surer sign of racism in a community than the fact that the community makes a distinction between races.” I would say that the same applies to sexism. I remember being told by a girl that she needed my help because she wasn’t allowed to lift more than 50lbs.
In reference to the idea of sexism being Biblically justifiable, I remember watching a woman pastor got through the original Greek on the passage about women remaining silent during church services, and states that it’s actually the *exact* same language as when Paul cautions men about being disruptive while speaking in tongues. Which means that Paul was *actually* treating men and women exactly the same.
As to the main point of shaming people, that is the norm of correction at Teen Mania. Even if someone is respectful enough to take you aside, they try to shame you into compliance with *their* interpretation of the rules and standards. And most interns aren’t respectful enough to take you aside, so they’ll just confront you publicly.
Here’s the thing. Jesus DID confront that woman’s sin. He called her out, to her face. In fact, He brought it up out of nowhere. (John 4:16).
The law is there to point out our sinfulness so that we turn to God.
That talk SUCKS! It makes me so PISSED off. CRAP! How can he be like that! Man, I need to go FART I’m so mad!
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