I started the Honor Academy in January 1997 just after Teen Mania moved to Garden Valley. Things started out on the wrong foot from the get go. I was under Kim W’s supervision and she seemed to take an instant dislike to me. I later learned that this was partly because Kim was best friends with my Project Directors from El Salvador, and I now had been pegged as ‘rebellious’ before I ever set foot on campus.
Because of my ‘rebellion’ I was under close supervision by everyone, and everything was all reported back to Kim, Mercer or Dave. I would be ‘confronted’ on a near daily basis on what I wore, what I ate, who I ate with, who I walked to or from work with. My clothes were found to be improper, even though they fell within the guide lines.
For example, after driving cross country to get to TX, my dad called to remind me I’d need an oil change. (My mechanical abilities began and ended with, putting gas in the car to make it go.) After gauntlet week I asked a group of 5-6 guys if they knew where I could get an oil change. They said there was a garage on campus and they could change my oil there and show me how. So the next time we had a night free, me and 6 guys crammed into my car and drove to the garage to start ‘project oil change’. One of the guys pointed to a pile of work clothes and suggested that I change so I didn’t get my clothes dirty. Sounded like a good plan to me, so I dug through the pile and found jeans and a shirt that were relatively close to my size, went in to the bathroom and changed. The guys worked on changing the oil, and pointed at car parts that I apparently should have known about, and after the car was done I went into the bathroom changed back into my clothes. We all went back to the dorms to hang out before curfew.
The next day I was called in to Dave Hasz’ office and was retold the events from the night before. By the time it got to him, it sounded like I had done a strip tease for the guys and that ‘oil change’ was possibly a euphemism. I explained that I had changed in to some work clothes in private behind a locked door and that nothing improper happened. At this point I’m thinking that this is just a misunderstanding and Dave’s going to laugh, and say that’s all!?
Not so much, He didn’t miss a beat, he leaned forward in his chair and said to me, ‘What do you think that does to a guy?! To know there is a woman undressing in the very next room!’ He then went on the lecture me on how it was my job as a ‘woman of God’ to help keep the men from thinking lustful thoughts. (As if I could control someone else’s thought process!) I pointed out that the girls dorm was a floor above the guy’s dorm, if this was his logic, how were they going to handle knowing there were 50 girls upstairs sleeping, showering, changing clothes… etc? This didn’t win me any favors, logic had no place here. Long story short, I left Dave’s office with a list of clothes I could and couldn’t wear (v-neck could potentially show cleavage, causing my brothers to fall, everything should be loose fitting, not too much leg…), what kind of make up (no dark eyeliner!) and nail polish I should and shouldn’t wear (only red, pink or clear no blue or black…), and was assigned to dish duty for a week. I was mortified.
All of that was frustrating and humiliating enough, however it was the isolation that killed me. About a month into my internship, a guy that I had a 5 minute conversation with at breakfast, called me at work to let me know Dave had told him, ‘he should limit his time with me.’ I didn’t understand where this was coming from, I called Dave Hasz for a meeting. The gist of that meeting was, yes indeed, I was a ‘bad seed’ in a sea of ‘super Christians.’ Dave proceeded to list off what my character flaws were, what he felt I should do to change myself, the direction he felt my life should be going in. And oh by the way since we’re talking about it, here’s a list of people that I should limit my time with be cause they were ‘bad seeds’ as well. He listed off just about every friend I had made over the last 6 weeks.
The ‘character flaws’ Dave listed off weren’t bad things, they were things that I really liked about myself. I liked that I was quirky, creative, and spunky but this didn’t fit into the TM mold, and therefore must be bad. I didn’t understand how Ron Luce could speak at every ATF and tell kids to not be a cookie-cutter christian but at the HA I was being forced into a mold.
I was miserable, felt that if I was hanging out with my friends, I was being disobedient. But the ‘super interns’ didn’t want anything to do with me other then to report back to my Advisor or Dave about what the ‘bad seed’ was up to. I was just expected to be perfect, and know everything. If I asked what I could do to be better, all I would get was vague answers or direction, then being punished for not understanding precisely what was meant or implied. It was so frustrating. I felt like I was being held up to an invisible measuring stick and I was falling miserably short. It was kind of like asking. “Left or right?” then being yelled at because I went too far left, or I should have understood that they really meant ‘slightly right.’ Nothing I did was good enough, I don’t think a week went by that I wasn’t on dish duty or campused, or both. The main message I walked away from TM with was, leadership was right. Period. They had the option of changing their mind later, but that didn’t mean that they were previously wrong.
I felt like my family was turning their back on me, because I was bad and didn’t ‘fit the mold.’ A deep depression started setting in. I had no one to confide in, leadership was only there to tear me down, not lift me up. I was done. 5 months into it, I left the internship. During the family meeting Dave stated my decision to leave was ‘mutual’ and that TM would refund me the balance of my money. This was a lie, one that my mother was witness to. My dad called TM once I got home regarding this refund. He was told that TM was a non-profit and no one was entitled to a refund for any reason. Needless to say my parents were not happy. I told them, that was what it was like. They say one thing, but when you follow up, its entirely a different story. I quit drinking kool-aid that day.
To this day I struggle to remember that being unique is OK. I don’t have to follow the letter of some arbitrary law, its far more important to be a good, kind loving person than it is to be perfect.
50 comments:
My heart has sunk reading this. It reminds me a lot of my treatment while at the HA. . . AND it reminds me of the way that interns “shunned” the “bad seed”. BLAH! The prejudice was so great that it was like a black cloud around them. . . oh no! The thinkers are coming! Beware! They may cause you to ask questions. *gasp* I remember coming in as an August and seeing how the Januaries had been segregated perfectly in the “good-bad” groups, and remember liking a girl in the “bad” group. . . later they dismissed her for supposedly being a witch. I never knew what happened to her. It was really really weird. Erase people. . . . that’s normal and healthy. BLAH.
Give me a break!
June 23, 2010 8:13 AM
Shannon Kish said…
Kate,
I can say without a doubt in my mind that we respect diversity here. As an Atheist I was afraid that my lack of belief would somehow hinder my ability to be a part of this community, but I couldn’t have been more wrong. I have been accepted, my atheism and all.
June 23, 2010 8:32 AM
Shawna Mizer said…
I’m a bit livid right now. This is all such BS!!! Not your story, but the response. And apparently the response hasn’t changed over time. Your story is from 97, several others from my years (00-02), and still it’s the same in the last couple years.
It just pisses me off that people are marked as “bad seeds” and then can’t do a damn thing to remove that label, no matter how incredibly hard they try.
And I’ve known a lot of the people on here, we were friends, and they were some of the best people I met at TM. It makes me so angry that good people were treated like dirt, without and ounce of grace or forgiveness or a chance.
I need to stop now before I just start repeating myself using mostly explicatives. I’m just so mad and so sorry about it all.
June 23, 2010 9:39 AM
Mel M said…
Kate;
I’m with you on how you felt. I started christmas 97 and my groupd of friends were called the click and slowly but surely all but I beleive 4 were expelled early. I for falling in love with a boy who I never touched, never talked to for fear of break rules. When Dave found out I was expelled and we were kept apart. My world crumbled that day…….returning home early cause my church to believe I was a bad seed and spread nasty rumors of me all over town. My belief in god and people has never been the same since.
Thank you Kate for this site. I’m just sorry you and I and many others had to experience the pain and shame from going to the TM.
Thank you again.
Mel
June 23, 2010 10:36 AM
Z said…
What a horrible experience, Kate! I’m so sorry!
Seriously, what kind of pervert gets all hot and bothered about a woman changing in another room?! Seems to be a common theme in conservative Christianity — women are blamed for men’s lust. Makes me so frustrated!
June 23, 2010 11:28 AM
Z said…
Does Dave realize comments like that make him sound like a horney bastered?
I really get an icky feeling just from reading stories about him.
June 23, 2010 11:36 AM
Anonymous said…
Kate, I’m very sorry for your experience. But this doesn’t make sense. TM allows v-necks and any color of nail polish. The people there are anything but normal. They are fun and they don’t have a mold but their own. I don’t know what happened in ’97 but ’08 to ’10 is nothing like you experienced.
June 23, 2010 12:27 PM
Nunquam Honorablus said…
Anonymous, I’m not sure about that.
I was an intern in 07-08, and there was still a lot of splitting friends up and indefinitely not allowing certain people to talk to each other because they “didn’t build each other up”.
The limit on makeup and some-people-can-wear-this-but-not-that were still around, albeit to a MUCH lesser degree. I will give you that! 😉 Granted, my year, there were a lot more guys walking around with v-necks than girls!
June 23, 2010 1:06 PM
Anonymous said…
Hey, question for anonymous at 12:27, since you are at TM right now:
I’m wondering if the H.A still does/has the following (if you need clarification on something let me know) or anything similar:
–Monthly spiritual evaluations from C.A.
–Graduation defense
–Different graduating levels
–Different “honor” levels for interns
–Accountability cards
June 23, 2010 1:08 PM
Nunquam Honorablus said…
^ I left in 2009, and a lot of Facebook friends are still at the HA, so here’s what I know from that.
CA evaluation: yes
Graduation defense: yes, along with Midway defenses.
Different graduating levels: Aside from the optional PUMA class thing, I don’t think this existed.
Different “honor” levels: Nope, there wasn’t anything like that. Except for your lifestyle and work evals, which averaged out to be a spiritual GPA of sorts.
Accountability cards: as of June 2009, yes. Beyond that I’m not sure.
Again, this is as of 2009. Anonymous, I’d love to see how current HA life stacks up! 🙂 Correct me if I’m wrong or if I left anything out, or if it’s all changed in the past year.
June 23, 2010 1:55 PM
Anonymous said…
seriously, this blog is lame. You people hide behind this blog so nobody can know who you really are while you just talk smack.
Your the kid at the zoo that makes fun of and harasses the monkeys. When the monkeys have enough of it, they fling their poo on you.
So… hopefully someone will fling poo back at you because you can only hide behind a website and talk trash for a period of time.
June 23, 2010 2:10 PMJacqueline said…
Anonymous @ 2:10
I find it ironic that you did not sign your name.
June 23, 2010 2:21 PM
Nunquam Honorablus said…
I think they’re just trolling.
While unnecessarily insensitive, I fully doubt that they were being serious.
June 23, 2010 2:44 PM
Jacqueline said…
Nunquam,
you rock.
June 23, 2010 3:24 PM
CarrieSaum said…
i think you are right, nun. but just in case, anon, i have never hidden my identity. 🙂
katie, this existed when i was an intern in 99. it is so crazy to me to think that anyone would ever freak out over you changing in another room! i’m pretty sure i had to change on a bus once, with nothing but a sleeping bag to cover me. hehehe.
June 23, 2010 3:28 PM
Anonymous said…
Dave Hasz is sexually repressed….. or perhaps maybe not……
Anon
June 23, 2010 3:38 PM
Shiloh said…
Why do I play the game?
….
seriously, this blog is lame. You people hide behind this blog so nobody can know who you really are while you just talk smack.
Your the kid at the zoo that makes fun of and harasses the monkeys. When the monkeys have enough of it, they fling their poo on you.
So… hopefully someone will fling poo back at you because you can only hide behind a website and talk trash for a period of time.
….
This comment was stupid on so many levels.
uhg. Kates like, ‘T.M. accused me of being seductive, watched me day and night, then told me it was a ‘mutual feeling’ about me leaving and they’d refund my money but it was all lies. and man… that really hurt me.’
And friggen Anon is like, ‘I hope monkeys poo on you.’
Just stupid.
Anyways. To Kate. Your story is KILLING me! Why THREE PARTS?!?!?!?!? I can’t handle the suspense.
June 23, 2010 5:03 PM
C.R. said…
I always found the relationship malarky as a pile of crap.
If your a first year intern, you cant even hint at talking to a member of the opposite sex without getting reamed like you took them out in the back and had sex with them. You cant be alone with someone of the opposite gender without eyebrows being raised. You cant even be good friends with someone of the opposite gender without some issues and talks from the staff.
If your a second year intern, your allowed to date. Like one year is going to make a massive difference among a group of teenagers! Teenagers have, and always will be, hormone driven individuals. I don’t care how spiritual you are!
As far as Dave’s comments go. He has got one dirty dirty mind. Thats all I have to say without getting vulgar.
June 23, 2010 6:51 PM
Shannon Kish said…
Anon- I am not sure how posting under my real name, Shannon Kish, with a direct link to my blog (which links to just about every way you can contact me) is hiding behind this blog. I, for one, have also been very vocal OUTSIDE of this blog… facebook and twitter are my friends. 🙂
June 23, 2010 10:16 PM
Anonymous said…
Have questions for TM leadership? Join a live conference call this Monday, June 28th from 8p-9:30p CST. David Hasz, Heath Stoner, and others will be taking calls live. If you would like to e-mail in your question send it to: confcall@recoveringalumniresponse.com
More details at recoveringalumniresponse.com
June 24, 2010 8:52 AM
littlegraygirl said…
Okay, seriously….I find it creepy and inappropriate for Dave to have had that conversation with Kate. Lets say he was misinformed about what went on in the shop, and he had a valid concern about Kate’s behavior or even just wanted to hear what happened from her perspective, he totally should have had a female in leadership talk to her. He is kind of like a father-figure to the interns on campus; it would’ve really skeeved me out if he had confronted me about my sexuality.
When it comes to the men on campus, TM focuses WAY too much on sex. I don’t know if they still do this, but back when I was there Trailer Club would have a “Sex and Pizza Night” (top secret, of course–I wasn’t supposed to know about it), where they basically sat around eating pizza and talking about sex. I’m not saying that sex is a bad thing to talk about–on the contrary, I think it is a very good thing to address–but it was over-glamorized so much. The boys walk away with the belief that sex is the most amazing, mind-blowing event they will ever experience, that awesome marital sex will be their reward–their RIGHT, even–for being a good Christian and scoring a “godly wife”. They could easily acquire a sense of entitlement, with very selfish attitudes about sex, having no real understanding of a woman’s sexual needs (or that she even has any). They just know that the Bible says that she isn’t allowed to “withold” herself from him, so he is going to probably be getting it on 6 to 10 times a week.
In the meantime, they obsess about having sexual thoughts because they are beat over the head about not lusting, so if they didn’t already have lust issues when they came in to the H.A., they’ve probably developed them by the time they get out. Not to mention that they are taught that any woman they are tempted by is a “whore of Babylon”….so a male intern can end up being downright hateful to a girl he finds himself attracted to. Because it is HER fault for not containing her sexuality better or something…
My point is, and I guess I could’ve just said this to begin with, is that TM has a VERY unbalanced view of sex and the attitudes they instill in the men (and women!) that go through the program are harmful.
June 24, 2010 10:10 AM
Anonymous said…
littlegraygirl, I’ve heard this kind of thing spoken about TM many times before. TM/HA builds up men to fail in marriage by crushing their wife with their actions. I can confirm that these allegations are in fact true. Thanks for sharing.
Anon
June 24, 2010 10:53 AM
Anonymous said…This post has been removed by a blog administrator.June 24, 2010 11:09 AM
Anonymous said…
The great thing about a BLOG is that no FACTS have to be checked. You can say anything you want.
June 24, 2010 11:22 AM
Recovering Alumni said…
Anon – That’s also the great thing about a ministry with no accountability and complete control over its slaves – I mean interns.
June 24, 2010 11:42 AM
Nunquam Honorablus said…
Anon 11:09 and 11:22,
Were you there for Kate’s year? Can you prove your implied claim that Kate is lying or stretching the truth, or even mentally ill?
Or are you just trolling for the sake of trolling?
Not cool, bros.
June 24, 2010 11:47 AM
Anonymous said…
If accusations are going to be made, then questions need to be asked.
If not, you find yourself blindly following an accusation much like you found yourself blindly following TM.
You can delete differing opinions all you want. It just shows you are threatened by the questions asked.
June 24, 2010 11:57 AM
Recovering Alumni said…
I delete rude comments in accordance with the comment policy…this line of “deleting differing opinions” is tired…There are plenty of comments hear I disagree with. But they are presented in a rational way.
I won’t tolerate verbal abuse to the people that post their stories. Which is exactly why I deleted the comment above.
June 24, 2010 11:59 AM
shouldcareless said…
it’s not deleting “differing opinions”. it’s deleting harmful, hurtful ones that only serve to wound the wounded more deeply. please take your vitriol somewhere else.
June 24, 2010 12:00 PM
Anonymous said…
Asking if someone is bi polar or on sever medication is not vitriol or harmful. It is a matter of fact and should be considered when making accusations toward people.
June 24, 2010 12:03 PM
Anonymous said…
quote, “Is this girl by polar? Seriously”
Nothing rude or presuming about that. Just a question.
June 24, 2010 12:07 PM
Recovering Alumni said…
You originally asked it in a rude manner. Or rather, you seemed to assume it.
Even if she had mental health issues, what does that have to do with the story? Is it ok to treat people with mental issues poorly?
June 24, 2010 12:07 PM
Anonymous said…
You will not put words in my mouth. . .
I will not even respond to that accusation. . .
Using such tactics is what landed you this blog job.
June 24, 2010 12:12 PM
Candor said…
“I didn’t understand how Ron Luce could speak at every ATF and tell kids to not be a cookie-cutter christian but at the HA I was being forced into a mold.”
This gave me chills. SO 110% TRUE!!!
I recently moved and found a new therapist. Ironically, although I no longer trust Christians because of what happened to me at the cult, this woman happens to be a Christian. We recently got into the name of the cult and I told her all about it. She was in shock. She had other clients who had sent their children to ATF’s. The key word being HAD. I gave her websites to the cult as well as this recovering cult website and I can guarantee she’s been discouraging everyone she comes in contact with from having any sort of affiliation with it.
June 24, 2010 12:25 PM
Anonymous said…
Please don’t put words in my mouth. I am not even going to respond to that last statement. Those types of comments are what landed you this blog job.
If someone suffers from bi polar or another situation that needs heavy medication they don’t reason or think properly.
Everything they say and do must be taken into consideration.
June 24, 2010 12:26 PM
Recovering Alumni said…
Anon – Thanks for outlining your reasoning ina rational manner. See, was that so hard?
June 24, 2010 12:27 PM
Anonymous said…
I respect the comments from Shawna Mizer. I don’t know if any of you know her but she spent at least 2 years, if not 3, at the cult. She never had any problems and generally speaks very highly about her time there. However, she logically understands that many of her friends and acquaintances suffered a great deal of emotional, spiritual and physical suffering from their time there.
Just because it didn’t happen to you, doesn’t mean you need to be an ignorant prick about it.
June 24, 2010 12:34 PM
Anonymous said…
Maybe this question was addressed somewhere, but is Kate even this girls real name.
There were only four people who worked with Kim W. in 97. 2 were from the August class and 2 were from the January class.
I can name all of them, but that would do no good.
You see, they all finished the internship program.
June 24, 2010 12:37 PM
Anonymous said…
@Anon 12:12
Jesus said “A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another; as I have loved you, that you also love one another. By this all will know that you are My disciples, if you have love for one another.” – John 13:34-35
If I were to look at your comments and compare them to the above scripture, I’d come to some pretty serious conclusions about you. Where’s the love, man?
June 24, 2010 12:37 PM
Anonymous said…
HERE IS MY PROBLEM:
Maybe this question was addressed somewhere, but is Kate even this girls real name.
There were only four people who worked with Kim W. in 97. 2 were from the August class and 2 were from the January class.
I can name all of them, but that would do no good.
You see, they all finished the internship program.
June 24, 2010 12:43 PM
Nunquam Honorablus said…
That’s probably not her real name. A lot of the true stories here are posted under pseudonymns, to protect confidentiality, similar to signing a comment as “anonymous”.
June 24, 2010 12:46 PM
Anonymous said…
I ask a lot of questions because there is conflicting information.
There were only four people who worked with Kim Wilkerson in 97. 2 were from the August class and 2 were from the January class.
I can name all of them, but that would do no good.
You see, all 4 finished the internship program.
Some want confidentiality, yet they throw out other people’s name rather freely.
June 24, 2010 12:51 PM
Recovering Alumni said…
Anon – Be patient. I’ve asked “Kate” to respond to this. I’m sure when she checks her email, she’ll comment.
June 24, 2010 12:51 PM
Anonymous said…
Add to that, I am in communication with 2 of them on a regular basis.
June 24, 2010 12:55 PM
Recovering Alumni said…
“Kate” just responded to me. As you will note in the post, she didn’t say she worked for Kim, she said she was under Kim’s supervision.
“Kate” worked in the call center under Melissa K. However, Kim W was her IA (Intern Advisor). As you will no doubt recall, IAs had the role that is essentially now taken by CAs. So, as head of her focus group, Kim W. was her spiritual supervisor, so to speak.
June 24, 2010 1:00 PM
Anonymous said…
I figured that would be the case.
June 24, 2010 1:04 PM
Anonymous said…
Anon at June 24, 2010 12:37 PM:
Bear in mind some people don’t follow the same guidelines you live by. There are MANY graduates of the cult who are now atheist or agnostic and DO NOT choose to live their lives in accordance to Christian scripture. Some “Christians” at the cult had a funny way of treating people so former cult memmbers’ spiritual beliefs now, or lack of any, shouldn’t surprise anyone.
June 24, 2010 1:09 PM
Recovering Alumni said…
You figured that would be the case? Really? You never mentioned that in your comments…
I’m all for asking questions and clarifying facts – but the way you wrote your comments seemed like an accusation and an assumption that she was lying.
You could have said, hey, I know everyone that worked for Kim – so how were you under her supervision? But, instead you implied she was lying and that she was somehow wrong in naming her abuser’s names. If you want to particpate in this community, you are going to have to do it with more grace and respect.
June 24, 2010 1:30 PM
firegirl said…
To Anon @ 1:04 and anyone else who is doubting Kate’s story: For what it’s worth, I was there at the same time she was and her story has a gut-wrenching ring of truth to me.
June 25, 2010 2:49 PM
Anonymous said…
Just quick observation….I don’t really understand why a comment asking if the writer of the post was “bi-polar” and was categorized as verbal abuse (which it probably was)….yet I see comments on here calling Dave a horny bastard, a pervert, saying that he’s sexually repressed, and that he has a dirty mind. Is this not classified as verbal abuse either? I mean, is that what this blog is supposed to be about, or is it supposed to be about healing? about talking through situations that happened to you at the honor academy with a community and helping each other recover? all i’m saying is that if you have one standard on your comments, you should keep that standard all across the board.
June 29, 2010 5:55 PM