As any intern will tell you, sleep is a precious commodity during your time at the Honor Academy. You are kept SO busy and push your body so hard, that most people spend the year in some stage of sleep-deprivation. I was so tired during the 2nd semester of my undergrad year that I would leave work every Friday at 5pm and go straight to bed, skipping dinner, and not wake up until Saturday morning. Dave Hasz’s attitude towards sleep is that, “You can sleep when you die.”
Parents considering sending their child to the Honor Academy might want to consider the effects of being over-worked and sleep deprived for a year (and paying for that privilege, I might add). I scanned Twitter recently to see what current interns are saying about the Honor Academy. Here are a few tweets that highlight both the sleep-deprivation and general attitude towards sickness. I won’t publicly disclose their identities, but if you’d like to verify their authenticity, I will be happy to send you a link.
i think my body is so exhausted it is about to collapse into a coma. that’s fine.
Wonders if it is possible to fall asleep while walking hope not since i might soon
As graduate interns we have responded to the call to not sleep for a entire year…
there is no rest at TeenMania…the only rest is the push-up position
knocked out 5k this morning. not too bad for 3 hours of sleep.
It’s official. i’m never getting to sleep.
just woke up in a puddle of drool on his desk…guess he was tired…
Sleep is most definitely not one of the core values of the honor academy…
This is pathetic: i’m gonna be on the sick & injured wall cuz my toe hurts. Whoever thought that 1 little thing could cause so much trouble.
I have freaking knives in my throat and they’re STILL making me make calls here at GE… I hate being sick.
I hate pain, did i ever mention that? I have a low pain tolerance. I am ashamed to admit i am not very strong…
Pain… shooting… through… foot… I can’t stand or walk or run, yet i keep doing all of the above. Why do I keep going?
28 comments:
When people are in a sleep-deprived state they are more open to suggestibility. The book “Combatting Cult Mind Control” by Steve Hassan explains this thoroughly.
March 2, 2010 10:08 AM
Recovering Alumni said…
That is an excellent point.
March 2, 2010 11:19 AM
carrie said…
I experienced extreme adrenal fatigue at the internship, and still struggle with it now. Because I was forced to stay awake and moving at a rapid pace for such an extended period of time, my adrenal glands were always in hyper-production. This stressed them beyond their natural capacity, and I have been on supplemental adrenal therapy for several years now as a result. It started on my mission trip, and I never recovered. At 18, 19, 20, etc, people are still growing and NEED sleep. The scriptures about sleeping and becoming lazy are grossly taken out of context, as well as the “beating our bodies” scripture. the bible is not in favor of self-abuse, and intentionally depriving oneself of desperately required sleep, and exerting yourself while injured without the means for self-car are just that: self-abuse. i hope TM can change their idea about how to treat our bodies as the temple that God created them to be, instead of as the “slave” that they mistakenly think Paul portrays it to be.
March 2, 2010 11:52 AM
Nunquam Honorablus said…
Haha, this is like when my core confronted me for not going to Corporate when I had strep. Nevermind it was JANUARY and BELOW FORTY.
Yet there were other girls that simply said, “oh I don’t feel good”, didn’t go, and were all sunshine and energy by 8am. All they got was a playful “tsk tsk” from their roommates.
I distinctly remember Hasz saying, “The only reason you should not go to Corporate, is if you are throwing up uncontrollably.”
So even if you’re SICK, but not VOMITING, you can still sit outside on concrete for an hour. Because, you know, lying down to rest your sick/injured body is namby-pamby.
March 2, 2010 11:56 AM
Carol said…
I remember being exhausted all the time in the internship. We used to call Monday “marathon Monday” because we would wake up at 5am to exercise, and not get a moment’s rest until about 10pm that night after our quite time, after working all day, after our Perspectives on the World Christian Movement class and our Core Group Meetings. We would literally fall into bed exhausted.
During our work shift, a lot of us took to bringing alarm clocks into the call center so we could sleep under our desks during our 15 minute breaks. I remember having a pillow or a blanket in there as well.
Folks in my year used to make fun of me because I used to sleep a lot instead of socializing. I still regret not making more friendships in the internship, but a girl needs some sleep. To this day I still remember the phrase “You will pass out long before you die, so keep going”. Wow – what a horrible lesson to teach kids. I’ll bet that’s NOT a lesson that the TM ‘leaders’ kids have learned (or at least I hope not). What makes it ok for the leaders to treat OTHER PEOPLE’S KIDS THAT WAY??????? Do they treat their own that way – probably not!!!!
I also remember building bunk beds for the first time after TM moved to the new campus. We worked 8 hours on, 8 hours off for days and days building those bunk beds. We were walking zombies! Even when I was at TM I questioned WHY we had to pay to be TM’s slaves?
Don’t get me wrong, there were some great lessons I learned from sleep deprivation. I now know that my body doesn’t work well without a normal amount of sleep – thanks TM. I know that I certainly CAN push my body beyond what I thought, but that’s when injuries happen – thanks TM. I learned that slavery is still bad and still demoralizing – thanks TM.
All kidding and sarcasm aside though, I did learn some good things about pushing myself. I’m a bit older and a bit more wise now and understand my limits and have learned to draw clear boundaries. This was a lesson well learned while at TM.
March 2, 2010 12:23 PM
Robbie said…
Anonymous hit the nail on the head…it serves Teen Mania well to keep kids in a sleep deprived state. This is true not just for the internship, but for Global Expeditions and Acquire the Fire as well. I remember, at times, getting just a few hours of sleep each night when I was on my GE in 1998. At ATF, teens often get very little sleep after the Friday night session, since most groups need to travel (and since youth group sleepovers don’t really lend themselves well to actual sleeping)…then it’s back to the arena bright and early the next morning for a full day of indoctrination! From the moment someone gets involved in Teen Mania, sleep deprivation plays a key role in the emotional experience that sucks people further and further into the world of TMM.
March 2, 2010 2:14 PM
Anonymous said…
When I was an intern I recall Dave Hasz encouraging the interns to get plenty of rest. Certainly, a person had to prioritize to get sleep. However, that is just how life works. The grown up worlds of college and career are no different – Busy. I encourage anyone reading this to not throw stones at TM, but to see what Jesus says it means to serve Him – Matthew 10:38-39
March 2, 2010 3:27 PM
Nunquam Honorablus said…
Anonymous- the grown up worlds of college and career don’t spiritually abuse you into feeling guilty for getting as much sleep as your body needs.
March 2, 2010 3:48 PM
Recovering Alumni said…
Wow, really? Dave Hasz encouraged you to get plenty of rest? Are we talking about the same Dave Hasz?
That’s just flat out untrue when he continually says, “You can sleep when you die.” And even the tweets of these current interns (who are all pro-TM) prove you wrong.
And you really want to quote proof texts? What about “Come to me all who are weary and heavy laden and I will give you rest.”
March 2, 2010 4:11 PM
gc1998 said…
i have no memories of tm that do not involve being tired…4 mission trips, 1 adventure trip, a few ATFs and a year-long internship…
March 2, 2010 4:20 PM
gc1998 said…
i have no memories of tm that do not involve being tired…4 mission trips, 1 adventure trip, a couple ATFs and 1 year long internship…i’m pretty sure i was exhausted the whole time.
March 2, 2010 4:31 PM
carrie said…
@anonymous:
are you kidding?!?! surely, you are joking right now. for me (and you can read my story in the True Stories section of the blog under “Carrie’s Story”), there was no possible way to prioritize. and i know that i was not alone. there is no conceivable way to do your job, do all of your classes, homework, exercise, quiet times, bible reading, etc., and still be able to sleep for 8 hours a night. and also, there is nothing wrong with saying something contrary…that does NOT institute “throwing stones”. it is the truth.
March 2, 2010 4:55 PM
Ex-Intern Aug 07 said…
What about the guys on breakfast K-Crew? They have to be up for like 4.30am every weekday morning, and then their roommates keep them awake until gone midnight every night! Sure, they didn’t do corporate in the morning, but they had to do it in the evening or between classes
March 2, 2010 6:03 PM
Natalie said…
haha. One time I borrowed my friends car and slept in it until 5:30am so I could miss corporate… if they couldn’t find me they couldn’t make me go… 🙂
I don’t know if it’s not possible to get the full amount of sleep at T.M. I had a pretty sweet deal for ministry placements so I got plenty of rest and sleep. But I made it a priority, I spent a lot of time with the Lord and made it through with all the sleep I wanted.
haha. So for me it was the opposite. I got confronted all the time on sleeping too much. lol. and granted, I did like to sleep 😉 but it was only the one’s who got up at 4:30am to exercise every morning or who stayed out until all hours of the night that confronted me. But I sure got nick named the ‘lazy one’ because I got my sleep. And I really had that written over me all year and accused myself of it for about a year afterward. And truth was, I was really just getting 8 hours of sleep instead of hanging out and that was the accusation against me.
March 2, 2010 7:05 PM
z said…
Really good point, Robbie. I never thought about it that way before. . . I wonder how much little sleep aids TM in indoctrinating kids at Aquire the Fire. Interesting how Friday night at ATF is sort of less intense, more fun and hype then the kids leave, get little sleep and come back to ATF on Saturday for the more intense day of ATF where the pressure is on sign up for a mission trip.
I don’t know how much of that is systematically planned to be an indoctrination strategy, but the whole set up certainly works to their advantage!
I remember being completely EXHASTED by the end of an ATF weekend.
March 2, 2010 7:06 PM
z said…
What a crazy environment where people feel it appropriate to confront each other about getting too much sleep.
Is “too much sleep” a sin? No? Than how can you confront someone on the issue?
March 2, 2010 7:11 PM
Anonymous said…
I had mono during my time at Teen Mania, and never missed a day of work because of it. It would have been greatly frowned upon. Mind you I did end up taking extra long lunch breaks, and working later into the night. It was the only way I could even begin to get all the work done that was being required of me.
I got switched departments six times during my twelve months in the internship, and every department I was in worked overtime while I was there. Before I graduated I went back and counted and i had worked like 18 weeks of overtime.
My summer months at teen mania were draining… There were countless times I had been awake for going on 72 hours… and I’d worked about 65 of them. Two times I remember distinctly…
My AP drove me into lindale so I get something to eat because I’d missed meals in the caf do to working. We got subway but I was too tired to pick the sandwhich up to my mouth and eat it. Seriously. She stood by me in the shower and talked to me to make sure I didn’t fall asleep while showering. I took an hour nap before i went to WNS and then BACK to work for the night. I had a friend in California who would stay up and text me while I had to be awake at work in the middle of the night, making sure i didn’t fall asleep. The hardest hours were 2am-5am.
My last week at Teen Mania was probably the worst. I was the last intern off work before the gala and hadn’t slept more than two hours straight in like five days. I missed countless debriefing sessions… I remember sitting at the gala with my mom acrossed from me so tired i didn’t think i was going to make it. I left the gala and fell asleep on the floor of my dorm room in my dress. And didn’t wake up until the next morning. I missed my last night out with my family core because I’d been working so much.
March 2, 2010 10:17 PM
Recovering Alumni said…
Anon – wow, that is horrible.
I’m also reminded how most any form of sleep or rest is considered being “unproductive” (which is practically considered a cardinal sin at TM).
I remember feeling guilty for sleeping in past 9am on a Saturday because it meant I wasn’t being productive enough. What kind of message does this send about doing vs. being?
March 2, 2010 11:41 PM
Anonymous said…
I use to get so exhausted, I would spend a free Saturday sleeping all day, up for one meal and back to bed. I would skip Sunday service just to sleep. I was asked to see a doctor about this problem. I even refused to go to a meeting when on a mission trip because I was so tired I couldn’t wake myself up enough to know they were trying to get me up. Many years later, I found out I had an actual sleep disorder. I was lucky to not know if I was in the gossip or not. I just focused on me. However, I said a lot of things when counseling others during that year that I wouldn’t say today after understanding God’s true Love, Grace, and Mercy.
March 10, 2010 10:07 PM
Anonymous said…
I have been accepted to HA, but after reading the posts here, I’ve decided not to go. This post in particular gets to me because my mother has been sick and weak my whole life, I was ill for eleven years which caused heart problems, and I have many ill friends. By the philosophy that TM seems to have, we all have no faith or are living in sin. I know what it is like to be so weak that you can’t lift a cup of water. I know what it is like to be in so much pain that you want to die just to have peace. I have seen people I love weep because they can’t walk without the help of thier own small children, let alone care for them. I lived on the comfort of the Lord alone while ill, and I learned how to be compassionate for others through it all. How many times was Jesus moved by commpassion to help someone, to heal them? He came with healing hands, but the elite Christian warriors are supposed to scoff at weakness and ignore pain? By not helping the weak, wounded, and pained, we would be no better than the Priest and temple assistant who walked by the Jewish man. It was a despised Samaritan who helped the man, and Jesus said that we should go and do the same as the Samaritan in Luke 10:37. If HA teaches that Christians glorify God out of thier strength of will and determination, then I refer to Luke again. In Luke 21 1-4 Jesus watched the rich give from thier wealth, and a poor widow give from her poverty. Jesus said, “I tell you the truth, this poor widow has given more than all the rest of them, for they have given a tiny part of their surplus, but she, poor as she is, has given everything she has.” It is not powerful warriors that God desires, for He is so strong that we are ridiculus in thinking that He needs us. It is dedicated hearts that He wants. Fat or thin, slow or fast, dumb or smart, hideous or gorgeous, poor or rich, we all have hearts, and that is what God wants.
March 11, 2010 8:08 PM
Recovering Alumni said…
Anon – I am so impressed with what you’ve written. You are obviously wise beyond your years. Beautiful, beautiful thoughts. Thank you for sharing.
March 11, 2010 10:27 PM
Elizabeth said…
In keeping with the “No Rest For the Weary” post during my year Aug. 96-97, the Staff devised a “character building exercise”. It was almost twice a week for a month that Staff would came into the dorm rooms around 2:00am banging pots and shouting on bullhorns, demanding everyone wake up and report outside in 5 min. Once everyone was outside we were required to perform “team & character” building exercises: some low-ropes courses and trust exercises, being blindfolded and told to follow the voice of our group leader. These exercises became such a “normal” part of our expected nights that many Interns (myself included) slept full dressed in preparation for these drills.
March 14, 2010 4:17 AM
Anonymous said…
abusive.
dave hasz, i hope you read these blogs and weep, you foolish foolish man.
March 14, 2010 8:12 AM
Shannon Kish said…
Something I have always wondered– Have any of Ron’s college aged daughters attended the HA? What about Dave’s kids?
March 19, 2010 8:59 AM
Shannon Kish said…
To Anon who posted about College and “grown ups world”– During my undergrad years, I worked 40 hours and went to school full time. However, I still managed to find time to sleep and got more sleep than I did at the HA. The difference is that at the HA, you are considered a “slacker” or not committed if you take naps and other similar things. In college, it is the norm. I never felt an ounce of guilt when in between classes I would grab a few minutes of a nap. At TM, however, I fought to stay awake so that I wouldn’t be considered a slacker.
My graduate years are becoming similar to undergrad– grab sleep when you can.
March 19, 2010 9:09 AM
Anonymous said…
Ron’s kids didn’t go to the H.A. I remembering having a conversation about that with another intern. Because I was quite the pharisee, didn’t understand why they WOULDN’T go to T.M. cause I thought T.M. was the greatest thing in the world.
But there was something in me that thought about it. Why wouldn’t his own kids go?
March 19, 2010 10:08 AM
Shannon Kish said…
That would be my question to. If the HA is such a great place for growth in the Lord, why would his own children attend? Is it because their father is RL and therefore they don’t need a Namby Pamby HA since they are super spiritual by default? Who knows? But it is interesting to think about.
March 19, 2010 11:09 AM
Anonymous said…
I was talking to a good friend of mine about the whole: You can sleep when you are dead-heresy. Her automatic response was: “And you will be dead VERY VERY soon.”
March 21, 2010 11:23 AM
Pingback: Self-Abuse or Self-Compassion? – Recovering Alumni