Teen Mania has told so many lies about ESOAL and the physical health and safey of interns, I thought it was worth summarizing. These lies are even more egregious because they come from a ministry that continually stresses integrity, honesty and “doing the right thing no matter what the cost.”
I’ve limited the list to those lies that are publicly documented, although this is by no means an exhaustive list. Drop the scales from your eyes and behold the true character of Teen Mania….
1) Regarding ESOAL, Jon Hasz said, “We don’t think of ourselves as a boot camp,” “It doesn’t feel like that. It shouldn’t feel like that.”
Then why the camo fatigues? Why the leadership structure of sergeant, lt., general, commander, etc.? Why have interns answer with “Sir, yes sir!” Why have them ring a bell to quit, Navy Seals style? Why say, “this is based on Navy Seals hell week”?
2) In the Honor Academy Alumni Conference call, Dave Hasz said that they no longer use the chant, “It Pays to Be a Winner and You are a Loser.” However, the intern that JUST PARTICIPATED last week reported this was said to her.
Here is a picture from this years ESOAL. Look at the major’s shirt.
3) Dave Hasz lied to the news and said no cat food was ever served to interns at ESOAL. That is a lie. Click here for video.
4) During the conference call, David Hasz lied about the HA teachings of “Beat your body and make it your slave.”
5) Corporate Exercise – When questioned in the conference call about the safety of corporate exercise, David Hasz flat out lied about the nature and duration of the HA’s physical requirements.
Dave Hasz said that corporate exercise was a pretty tame regimen. Even the Teen Mania fanboys know that is an…ahem…understatement.
You can listen to the audio from the conference call (with fun visuals!) or read the highlights below.
“Corporate exercise is a pretty tame exercise regimen. We’ll do 25-30 jumping jacks, we’ll do some push ups, we’ll do some sit ups, We typically will run early on, we’ll run quarter of a mile or we’ll run/walk a mile, we’ll build up, the most the interns will run is probably 4-5 miles….
I have not taken the regimen, 25 jumping jacks, 20 push-ups and a mile to a doctor and said, hey do you think this is reasonable and safe?
At some point you have to trust that doing the pretty minimal exercise we are doing is safe.”
First of all, we all know that corporate exercise lasts about an hour, so unless the interns are working out in slow motion, simple math shows us that Dave is lying. Personally, I don’t ever remember corporate exercise being this “tame.” A few push-ups, sit-ups and a short run? Which Honor Academy is he talking about?
One current intern said:
This corporate exercise is meant to pretty much destroy you. Even if you are fit, it pushes you to or past your limits. The first couple days were really difficult as far as that goes. It left me feeling exhausted the rest of the day, where I almost fall asleep in the sessions later on in the day.
If corporate exercise is safe and he has nothing to hide, why does Dave lie about the requirements of corporate exercise during the conference call?
In fact, Dave Hasz refutes himself by telling us that just three weeks into the August internship, he took the interns on a 5.5 mile run during Saturday “extra training.”
If you cant’ read it, Dave’s status update says:
What a BEAUTIFUL morning – 63 degrees, 5.5 miles with the interns at extra training, clear, crisp – Ashley mowing the grass…..AHHHH a great day!
6) And of course, one of the biggest lies of all: ESOAL is safe.
DAVID HASZ IS A LIAR.
He lies. He bears false witness. Continually. Repeatedly.
You might not like that statement. But these are the facts. They are indisputable. This man has lied over and over again, with impunity. And he has never apologized for it.
If he cannot tell the truth about these things, why should we trust him about anything else?
38 comments:
it saddens me… I mean… i know its true… but I don’t want to believe it… I mean, there was a girl in my sistercore who was dismissed for lying… so.. what does this say to her?
There you have it, folks.
Man, I’d be amazed to see them last another couple of years.
Calling him a liar DOES make me uncomfortable, though. Even though he HAS routinely lied, I still feel like calling him a liAR, and attaching that to his character (despite how true it is), is still really… I don’t know the word. Harsh, maybe?
I mean, like, it’s well-founded, and you’re just calling a spade a spade, but I dunno. Maybe I’m being too sensitive about it.
I’d still love to hear him explain the cat food thing.
http://hastories.com/?p=818
Just wanted to see the group commentary.
This really breaks my heart. Still. We are all imperfect, we all lie. I hope that we can stand with integrity and repentance, though, if we are publicly caught out in our lies. I wish the facts were different. Very sad and disappointed in you, Dave. We all deserve much much more.
Thanks for posting that, heartsfire. Oh my gosh. An “independent committee of experts”? Results to be made public? I swear I’ve heard all this before. Maybe they can have the psychologist with the staff brother come back and say he knows ESOAL is safe because his kids liked it. *eyeroll* Really, I do hope they doable serious investigation of ESOAL but this sounds so much like the BOD sham investigation that I have little hope.
NH – while calling someone a liar maybe harsh, remember that Dave is a harsh man. I personally can not recall any time that Dave has dealt with an intern an a compassionate way. With Him it is either black or white. period.
Sometimes the truth IS harsh, because people are sometimes harsh.
Dave IS a liar. He has lied to me personally, publicly to interns, their parents, their supporters…it is time people start to see Dave Hasz for the man he is. A LIAR. And a harsh one at that.
Bravo RA, this is spot on.
I don’t know, I pretty much disagree with the current intern’s opinion of corporate exercise. It’s tough if you’re not in shape but even if you have reasonable amounts of stamina, it’s not hard at all.
Sure corporate usually lasts about an hour, but most of that is taken up by the run. Some people are slow and their cores don’t leave them. As a GI corporate for me would only last about 30 minutes. Once I did my run I just ran myself back to the quads for a nap before work. I didn’t have a core to wait on.
Also, “extra training” is if you don’t meet requirements like turning in your homework, cleaning your room, things like that. A certain amount of ‘marks’ and you go for a jog/walk on Saturday with Dave. It’s not something that just jumps out to surprise you.
Additionally, for question #1, what would you prefer? All the instructors wear pink? Have the leadership structure referred to by numbers? Allow anyone in ESOAL to just slouch around and say “yeah, whatever” to the instructors?
Considering your opinions of ESOAL, perhaps you would like to offer your version of an alternative?
I will be offering my alternative to ESOAL in a future post. 🙂
@heartsfire — “An independent committee of experts”? Hmm, where have we heard that before? Seriously, have these people learned nothing?
Dear Dave: It looks like hazing because it is hazing, it looks like abuse because it is abuse, and you look like a liar because you are a liar.
NH, the word you’re looking for is “true“. The word for somebody who routinely lies is “liar,” just like the word for somebody who routinely cheats is “cheater” and the word for somebody who routinely abuses is “abuser”…
I think I understand what NH is getting at. Something my husband is big on is defining “truth”. There’s the truth of our circumstances… and the truth of the gospel. Dave Hasz, in terms of the gospel message is not a liar. It’s what he does. It isn’t who he is. Because of Christ, DH is saved by grace. Redeemed and loved. Forgiven.
But we’re looking at the circumstances here. He has lied. He has been found to be a liar. If it makes it easier, call him “a man who lacks integrity”, but it’s just a nicer way of calling it what it is.
“Considering your opinions of ESOAL, perhaps you would like to offer your version of an alternative?”
What about Pikes Peak? I was emotionally stretched during the climb and learned plenty about myself along the way. When we made it to the top, I felt like I’d conquered the world. Nothing destructive there.
Why does there need to be an alternative? Just get rid of ESOAL. The end.
I would agree with Layne. Pike’s Peak was a great retreat. Granted, the spiritual parts of it had some problems, but the retreat itself was a great one.
I, too, agree with Layne about the Pike’s Peak challenge. Spiritually, I didn’t learn anything about myself. Emotionally, I didn’t learn anything about myself. Physically, I learned A LOT about myself. It was very intense and I felt like I had made a big accomplishment when I reached the top. Honestly, that is one of the few required events from the cult that I had a positive experience with. I think any “Christian” or non-christian would find it fulfilling.
There was a long time before ESOAL existed and we still managed to learn the same type lessons about pushing yourself in safer environments (Pike’s Peak, Tyler 10K).
I got the crap end of the stick during that retreat. I was in the Intern Relations department, so instead of getting to go home with my core, I had to stay an extra day to organize everyone’s insurance information and make sure that everyone got in the right vehicle.
Then I got to take the last bus home after “working” all day.
Other than that, it was a great retreat.
I think it is very clear and getting more and more so.
Dave Hasz is a liar.
Big question that I am honestly really trying to figure out csi style.
Why does he keep lying? And where is Ron in all of this?
I think Ron’s absence signals that if someone eventually has to take the fall for all this, it will be someone in Honor Academy. It definitely looks like the ministry is putting some distance between TM as a whole and the HA program…
I agree also with the comments about pikes peek. That is one of the very few good memories that I have of that place. I felt like I overcame so much in so many areas, primarily due to the encouragment I recieved as I climbed. ESOAL was the exact opposite. All they did was the opposite of encourage, and then acted surprised when I said I didn’t get anything from it
Where is Ron? I agree. I thought (according to TM)that a leader steps up and takes the blame. On one of my missions trips as a TL, I remember them saying that if something goes wrong on our Team it is the TL’s job to step up and take the blame. Where is RON?
@Julie
I think I see what you are saying but if the HA fails, TM is toast! How will TM ever run without hundreds of people paying to work there??
ahhh, the good ol pikes peak days. sorry for those who came after and have to deal with this bullshit hasz put you through. Very very abusive.
Pikes Peak was beautiful, fun, challenging and inspirational as you looked around at creation. Very spiritual. Thank God I was there before he went postal . . . I would have suffered for sure.
Brandon,
Maybe it’s changed drastically in the four years since I’ve been there, but I recall doing 100 jumping jacks during my first corporate, and working up to 200-300 later in the year. Unless you’re actually only doing 25 jumping jacks now, I’d say this is a blatantly misleading statement. And what does Dave always say? Lying is the intent to deceive.
I can only speak for my own experience. I was an intern 98-99 and I have never been an athlete. I hate running, exercise, especially doing that in front of other people. That being said, I didn’t think corporate exercise was that bad at all. I have had harder workouts on the Biggest Loser Boot Camp dvds. Yoga is more difficult in my opinion.
However, my year was when they put the new track in with no lights. Since we were up at 5am it was pitch black in the woods. I sprained my ankle on the raised edge of the track and hurt my knee as well. They put lights in soon after, but I don’t think we should have been put in an unsafe situation like that. Someone wasn’t thinking-which I think happens a lot at TM.
Pikes Peak was amazing, and after we did that, corporate exercise was no more, and we were on our own to exercise.
I have more concerns about ESOAL than anything else. I don’t think that retreat has any business in a program like HA, especially since today’s generation has seen more than their fair share of emotionally stretching experiences. I am glad they are postponing this. Hopefully it changes.
I love Dave Hasz, and I refuse to hold unforgiveness toward him. That being said, it does seem like there is a lot of defensiveness on his and the ministry’s part. That makes me sad for them, not angry.
A post filled with lies, half-truths, and assumptions…all to attack Dave Hasz for “lying.” Your hypocrisy is nauseating.
Please detail exactly what part(s) of this post is a lie or half-truth.
Good luck!
I <3 TM. I was with them for three years. Does it suck at times? yes. Are they always right? Nope, they are human too. Was ESOAL hard and a bit strange? Yes. Did I learn anything from it? Yes. Considering that ESOAL is optional, and not a requirement for your intern year, I think that complaining about it and bad mouthing it is pointless. All of my intern friends either enjoyed ESOAL or understood it’s value and learned from it.
Anon – It is amazing that you totally overlooked the entire point of this post – that Teen Mania’s senior leadership has lied many times. If TM is as good as you have claimed, then why are they lying? What do they have to hide? And why do you have such a hard time acknowledging that they have repeatedly lied?
SO your justification for a major ministry lying is that “everybody does it so it is no big deal?”
Wow, that makes no sense at all.
I would suggest you follow your own simple advice— Read your bible and pray for those that you don’t agree with.
I was an intern in 2002-2003. The corporate exercise that Dave talks about is true to what I remember for our year. And honestly, I thought corporate exercise was minimally hard. You are implying that a 5.5 mile run is unsafe? This is ridiculous.
I will echo those who have stated their year(s) at TM/HA were not traumatizing. I attended 2004-2006 and will never forget my experience. I didn’t feel my rights were taken away. I made sound decisions like the adult that I was and wasn’t given flack for it. I wasn’t well known or have any kind of advantage that made this time easier for me either. It was hard and pushed me, surely. Yet, it has helped me realize to this very day how much I give in to what is comfortable. Concerning ESOAL, I participated and rang out two days in – turning around to a line of people to congratulate my own finish. It’s not something I regret; I was worn out, had pushed myself pretty far, yet in no way was belittled or abused in this experience.
Something that continues to resurface in my mind is how many friends/people I know in the military who have specifically said their time in boot camp really woke them to how much their lives truly depend on the Living God. Knowing full well I won’t be joining the military, I was glad to hear of the similarity. So, it’s okay for our family and friends to go through military boot camp but not through a rigorous time simulating a boot camp where you /are/ allowed to ring out, etc? Yes, people get hurt during these things, it happens.
Back to my personal experience, I have to say that giving birth to my son was FAR more challenging physically and mentally than ESOAL. A natural birth with no medication was something I would not have chosen had I known how hard and painful it really would have been. But my body really could handle it, it was made for this. Half way through labor, hours in, I recalled the moment I rang out during ESOAL. Knowing full well I had no bell to ring out with, I had to keep going, there was no retreat. I had hours left to go, but to God be the glory, He was there with every push! The moment my son was born, I had a surge of energy just like I did when I rang out. I had finished well.
It’s time to move on- Jesus will judge us all.
I am an Alumni and I strongly disagree with the overwhelming ungodly slander that this smear site produces.
With that said a broken clock is right twice a day, Dave Hasz was the worst thing to ever happen to ATF. He was angry and arguably blasphemous in his demeanor. You’ll get no argument from me about this guy.
With that said this site needs to be removed as it is dividing the already weakened followers of Christ in America and allowing Atheists to sneak in here and poison Christians with half truthes.
LMFAO
Because God forbid Atheists have an opinion or a voice in their experiences!
And Anon… WHO is going to REMOVE this site? Sounds like a Communistic tactic to me.
By the way, your “slander” of Dave Hasz is stated quite well. You just did what you accuse others of doing.
By the way, I think the Christians on this site can take care of themselves with Atheists. I am a believer in Jesus Christ and see the outright hypocrisy of many of these so-called “Christian” organizations and see how they are using those around them. It is a money and power issue, anon..- not one of lovingly guiding young Christians in the Truth of God’s Word.
how you treat the least of these is how you treat me… you guys are slandering and straight up lying about the whole entire program. You all left the internship within like a month because you couldn’t endure esoal for 4 days. Quick question what are you going to do in the end times when Christians are persecuted? Esoal was easy, nothing abusive about it, sorry you got mud on your shoes… hope you recover well from that one it sounds real tough. The HA set my foundation for the rest of my life in my walk with Jesus. I praise God for Dave Hasz’s obedience and willingness to selflessly serve us daily
If by ‘left after a month’ you mean graduated the program, then I suppose you’d be correct.
If by lying you mean exposing the truth about an abusive culture, then again, you’d be correct.
But, you didn’t mean those things, which means that you are incorrect and have contributed nothing to the conversation.
It makes me sick to think that people like Anon @12:59 walk around presenting themselves as followers of Christ.
Anon @ 12:59,
Again, to echo RA’s question, which of the statements in the post is untrue? Bear in mind that if even one of them is true, Dave Hasz and Teen Mania have lied, which means this post is not slander.
“Quick question what are you going to do in the end times when Christians are persecuted?” Assuming that eschatology model is valid, I’m going to do what Jesus said: love my enemies, pray for those who persecute me, and obey God rather than men. None of which virtues ESOAL is designed to help anyone cultivate.
“how you treat the least of these is how you treat me…” Well, good thing we didn’t write an arrogant comment mocking you, then!
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