In preparation for some posts on the Honor Council next week, I leave you with this entry in “the Bible according to Teen Mania.”
If a man has a hundred sheep and one of them wanders away, what will he do? Won’t he leave the stay with the ninety-nine others on the hills and go out to search for the one that is lost let the lost one go since it left the boundaries and probably wasn’t cut out for the flock anyway?. And if he finds it, I tell you the truth, he will rejoice over it more than over the ninety-nine that didn’t wander away! In the same way, it is not my heavenly Father’s will that even one of these little ones should perish.
Matthew 18:12-14
37 comments:
What a wicked sinner…..WITCH WITCH! Lol
February 5, 2010 8:05 AM
w said…
grrr…this post is unfortunately true…it’s so hurtful for leadership (or other interns) to say that you did not hear God really calling you to HA and were out of His will by going to HA– because you weren’t cut out for it…This is a TRUE statement–speaking from personal experience…it is SO ELITIST to think this way–to think that by being at HA you are the cream of the crop..THAT is NOT what the bible teaches…
February 5, 2010 9:10 AM
Anonymous said…
This is ridiculous. RA, good work taking the bible and using it to wound and attack.
February 5, 2010 11:37 AM
HA Staff said…
RA,
Why do you continue to cause division? Forgive those at TM that caused you offense and give it over to God. You are recipient of God’s grace and forgiveness. Extend grace and forgiveness to those who have hurt you.
“I appeal to you, brothers, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree with one another so that there may be no divisions among you and that you may be perfectly united in mind and thought.” – 1 Corinthians 1:10
“Bear with each other and forgive whatever grievances you may have against one another. Forgive as the Lord forgave you.” – Colossians 3:13
February 5, 2010 11:45 AM
D said…
I think TM does a pretty good job for themselves at using the Bible to wound and attack.
And yeah, the policy of “forgiveness” (sweeping it all neatly under the rug) has worked sooooo well for the Catholic church all these years.
Forgive does not equal forget and does not mean that people who do wrong things should not be held accountable for their actions. When young people just out of childhood are being abused physically and mentally they need to have a voice both for healing and for warning.
February 5, 2010 12:41 PM
w said…
Amen to “D’s” posting!!!!
February 5, 2010 12:45 PM
Nunquam Honorablus said…
And a double-amen at that, I say!
Indeed, this policy of “forgive me while I go and conduct the same abusive behavior” is horrific.
Turns out, it was so hard for me to accept that TM was abusive, because I was brought up in a very similar environment. Probably why I thrived under the legalism and pharisee-like atta-boys.
When people asked me why I lived in fear of getting kicked out and sent to boot-camp (before HA), I would look at them like they were crazy! Their parents obviously sucked, because GOOD parents rule by fear! Those who knew me, know that I wasn’t a bad kid, so the threat of boot camp was ridiculous in hindsight (at my most rebellious, I flipped a kid off at school in ninth grade. The horror!)
The HA only magnifies that “do no wrong or get booted cause we’re too good for you” mindset.
So, do I forgive my parents?
Absolutely. Completely.
Will I advocate their parenting methods, or implement them on my own family?
Never, ever.
There’s a big difference, really.
February 5, 2010 1:05 PM
HA Staff said…
“Nunquam Honorablus” & “D”
There is NO intentional abuse that is happening at TM. I would imagine there are plenty of people who walk away from TM having a victim’s mentality that TM is the cause of all of their doctrinal problems. I would say MANY (not all) on this site that post their stories and negative comments never understood the vision of the ministry and have never truly understood who their are in Christ. When you understand who you are in Christ, than your self-confidence and joy is unshakable.
February 5, 2010 1:19 PM
Nunquam Honorablus said…
HA Staff,
Keyword: “intentional”. I am under no manner of belief that Hasz is trying to facilitate an abusive environment. In fact, I am pretty sure that he has only the purest intentions.
The only thing that’s wrong, is that these issues have been brought to the staff’s attention and ignored.
Now all we can do is publish our stories and hope that those interested in attending the HA get to see both sides before they make a decision.
Believe me: I hate the word “victim”. I have been discouraged from using it by my parents. I do not believe that I, myself, suffered abuse at the hands of TM. It was my fault for blindly accepting everything they gave me, without consulting the Word. I blindly trusted that they would give me everything I needed to know, and that was deeply wrong of me.
However, the fact that they’re even giving out false doctrine to begin with, and ignoring the fact that they are, is what is distressing.
February 5, 2010 1:41 PM
D said…
HA Staff,
How nice that you can just write off the experiences of anyone who has anything unpleasant to say about TM as being “less Christian” than yourself. I think your statement very clearly demonstrates the mentality that so many here have taken issue with. Works out quite well for you guys, eh?
February 5, 2010 3:14 PM
D said…
And you seriously believe that Good Christians are never sad? Really? You are really in for a rough ride one of these days.
February 5, 2010 3:17 PM
J97 said…
D I was frustrated by that statement as well “When you understand who you are in Christ, than your self-confidence and joy is unshakable.”
Seriously? So David was never shaken (joy or self-confidence)? b/c God called David a man after his own heart? Or what about Paul, or Peter, or Noah…
That’s the point- I don’t HAVE TO KNOW who i am in Christ- only Christ knows who I am! I just need to continue to seek him out daily- it’s NOT about me (or you). Because even in that God chose me way before I could ‘choose’ him!!!
February 5, 2010 3:33 PM
moriah said…
Dear HA Staff,
Your comments read as defensive, patronizing, egotistical, and self righteous Most of the participants on this blog are just working this out in the way the know how to, through the written expression of experience and emotion. If you feel like it threatens your spiritual identity, perhaps you should stop reading this blog, and simply put more of your energy into other efforts, like Teen Mania for example.Or you could start your own blog about how great the TM experience is for you. Each person is entitled to their own experience with TM, whether it be good or bad, and they are entitled to voicing their opinions. Your comments are not constructive or open or even tenderhearted, and therefore, I usually skip over them to more interesting thoughtful writers.
February 5, 2010 3:35 PM
Anonymous said…
Hi HA Staff – I’m “Caleb”. I wrote a few weeks ago. Your claim is so infuriating, that I can’t resist offering you my number so that we can chat about your ideas. Give me a call – 614-432-0779.
Phil – AKA “Caleb”
February 5, 2010 4:02 PM
Nunquam Honorablus said…
Caleb, they probably don’t have time for logic. However, I do greatly admire your boldness. Props!
Both of you, please let us know how it goes 😉
February 5, 2010 4:12 PM
Curious George said…
Oh, the irony.
Quote from RA in this post – “let the lost one go since it left the boundaries and probably wasn’t cut out for the flock anyway?”
Comment from HA Staff on this same post – “I would imagine there are plenty of people who walk away from TM having a victim’s mentality that TM is the cause of all of their doctrinal problems. I would say MANY (not all) on this site that post their stories and negative comments never understood the vision of the ministry and have never truly understood who their are in Christ.”
If I only knew that all of my heartache and depression and anger and suicidal tendencies were largely because I just, “never understood the vision of the ministry,” I could have fixed these little problems years ago.
February 5, 2010 4:17 PM
Cesna said…
DEAR POOPY HEAD RA
I AM A SIXTY SEVEN POINT HONORTARIANIST ELITE WARRIOR CHRISTIAN WOMAN
NOT NAMBY PAMBY
I LED 154 PEOPLE TO ACQUIRE THE FIRE THIS YEAR, SO THAT MAKES MY OPINION MATTER, SO WE NOW OUTNUMBER THE FIRST GENERATION OF POKEMANS. OBVIOUSLY MY HOLINESS IS THE ONE THAT GOT THEM TO HONOR ACADEMY, AND GOD WAS MY SIDEKICK LAWLO
John 11:35
35Jesus wept.
THIS SCRIPTURE CLEARLY STATES THAT JESUS IS CRYING BECAUSE YOU DISAGREE WITH TEEN MANIA
HOW DARE YOU POINT OUT THE FLAWS IN A FLAWLESS MINISTRY
EVEN THOUGH JESUS CALLED THE PHARISEES A BROOD OF VIPERS, HE WAS JUST GOOFING YOU GUYS
REMEMBER, I LED 154 PEOPLE TO ACQUIRE THE FIRE
154
I COUNTED THEM BECAUSE GOD’S GONNA ASK ME WHEN I GET TO HEAVEN HOW MANY PEOPLE I SAVED, THUS DEFEATING THE WHOLE PURPOSE OF LOVING AS CHRIST LOVED
DON’T YOU KNOW THAT JESUS WENT TO HONOR ACADEMY
GAH
WHAT’S WRONG WITH YOU
February 5, 2010 4:40 PM
Anonymous said…
…sorry… that was funny.
February 5, 2010 5:57 PM
Nunquam Honorablus said…
Cesna, what an impressive feat! Do you have tea parties and refrain from saying the word “fart”?
(seriously though that comment had me laughing for about six years)
February 5, 2010 6:07 PM
Diane said…
And Cesna wins the award for best comment of the month. And it’s only the 5th.
February 5, 2010 6:26 PM
Alum2000 said…
So, HA Staff – correct me if I’m wrong here, but from what you last posted you are agreeing with RA’s “Bible According to TM” post?
Writing off those of us who have had negative and hurtful experiences by saying we just didn’t understand the ministry or who we were in Christ it sounds a lot like, “let the lost one go since it left the boundaries and probably wasn’t cut out for the flock anyway…”
Oh, and who is it that decides when we get to the point where we truly “know who we are in Christ”? Do we ever fully get to that point? And who decides when a person gets to that point to where they can succeed in the HA? Personally, I don’t think I would like that responsibility.
February 5, 2010 6:32 PM
Recovering Alumni said…
Wow, I’m gone for a few hours and things go crazy around here. 😉
HA Staff – You said, “There is NO intentional abuse that is happening at TM.”
To me, that is the equivalent of putting your fingers in your ears and saying, “I can’t hear you!” I have documented MULTIPLE, REPEATED spiritual, physical and emotional abuses. I honestly don’t know whether or not they are intentional since I can’t see into people’s hearts. Nevertheless, THESE ABUSES DO EXIST. They are not isolated incidents. Yet you NEVER address them.
Instead your response is to call us liars and try to manipulate us. I guess its silly to expect anything else.
If you want anyone to take you seriously you are going to have to start engaging in some actual dialogue about the issues that have been presented here.
If you think you can intimidate me into backing down or guilt me into stopping by saying I am “causing division” or being “rebellious,” you are wasting your breath. Been there, done that. Got the t-shirt.
Cesna – HILARIOUS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Thanks for the laugh.
February 5, 2010 9:34 PM
Natalie said…
“I LED 154 PEOPLE TO ACQUIRE THE FIRE THIS YEAR, SO THAT MAKES MY OPINION MATTER, SO WE NOW OUTNUMBER THE FIRST GENERATION OF POKEMANS.”
“EVEN THOUGH JESUS CALLED THE PHARISEES A BROOD OF VIPERS, HE WAS JUST GOOFING YOU GUYS
REMEMBER, I LED 154 PEOPLE TO ACQUIRE THE FIRE
154″
Hahahahahahaha! *Heeping over in laughter cause this post was AMAZING.* I’ve been laughing all day at this comment and just wanted to tell everyone.
February 6, 2010 7:00 PM
Ex-Intern Aug 07 said…
Hahahahaha yeah I read it this morning and it’s made me laugh all day too! Classic 😛
February 6, 2010 7:25 PM
Anonymous said…
HA Staff-
So people who spent thousands of dollars to get to HA, traveled to the heart of Texas to work for free doing ministry all over the world and US probably were just not all that informed on the vision of the ministry…ok…trying to remmeber the last time I offered 1-2 years of my life without ever really checking into things?
Because you know, that most luke warm believers dilly-dally paying their hard earned money and time to go work for free and volunteer a couple years of their life to a ministry…yeah, that makes a lot of sense…
February 7, 2010 2:18 AM
Anonymous said…
In response to HA Staff (whomever you are…) to when you said the following:
“would say MANY (not all) on this site that post their stories and negative comments never understood the vision of the ministry and have never truly understood who their are in Christ. When you understand who you are in Christ, than your self-confidence and joy is unshakable.”
Ask a dismissed intern how their self-confidence and unshakable joy is…and don’t you DARE tell me they probably weren’t a true believer in the first place since they broke rules!
How irresponsible of you to reply like that–Does Dave or Heath know you are posting this? (or are they behind it?)…
February 9, 2010 12:10 PM
Nunquam Honorablus said…
Anonymous- good luck getting a reply. I think Cesna’s comment chased them away 😛
Caleb- did HA Shaft ever get in touch with you?
February 9, 2010 2:26 PM
Anonymous said…
I didn’t get a call, but I didn’t expect one. As far as I’ve ever known, as soon as things get down to the real nitty gritty – these types of challenges aren’t followed up with. Surely, someone that immature can’t really be on staff…I mean sweet moses, that’s some pretty rank arrogance. Of course, if HA Staff would like to really remove all doubt, I’ve always got my phone.
Caleb – Phil
February 9, 2010 3:04 PM
z said…
Censa, was your comment meant to be sarcastic humour or serious? I really can’t tell.
February 10, 2010 6:39 PM
Nunquam Honorablus said…
z, considering she called RA a “poopy head”, I truly and sincerely hope that she was not serious.
If not, I am gravely concerned that she would use Pokemon as a piece of her sermon illustration.
Unless of course you’re using sarcastic humor as well, and I am merely dense 😛
February 10, 2010 7:26 PM
Nunquam Honorablus said…
Goodness, look at all those adverbs. I’m on a roll!
Calebphil- that is a good point. I can’t really see them lying about that, though (the whole “intent to deceive” thing). Maybe fudging the truth, but not out-and-out lying.
Also, we have ample evidence that extenuating circumstances could have possibly affected HA Staff’s mood at the time of his or her posting.
February 10, 2010 9:08 PM
Cesna said…
I WAS BEING COMPLETELY SERIOUS
I USED THE HEATHEN MONSTER GAME AS A SERMON REFERENCE SO AS TO POSSIBLY MAKE YOU SINNERS UNDERSTAND THE MAGNITUDE OF MY HOLY DEEDS
SINNERRRRRRSSS
February 10, 2010 9:13 PM
Nunquam Honorablus said…
Oh, snap, my bad homes. I hope you accept my sincerest apology.
February 10, 2010 9:29 PM
z said…
Thanks Nunquam Honorablus. I’m not very familiar with Pokeman.
February 11, 2010 12:10 AM
Nunquam Honorablus said…
Haha, you’re probably better off for it. 😛
February 11, 2010 8:37 AM
Anonymous said…
Cesna, you might want to consider a career as a comedian or a writer… YOU ARE FREAKIN’HILARIOUS!
March 24, 2010 10:07 PM
mom of ex-intern said…
Above Anonymous:
I agree with you–Cesna IS hilarious–and so is Nunquam, for that matter–I love the comic relief they bring to such ‘heavy’ subjects!!! Keep it up, guys!
March 24, 2010 10:33 PM